Investigating the random deaths of Bea and Mikhail

[hundredand8]

Very few events on Lost have made so little sense as the deaths of Bea and Mikhail. She begs him to kill her, and he thanks Locke for killing him. What was that about? What fate awaited them that they prefer death?

The answer may be in their russian dialog just before she says "just do it", and I was wondering if there is a transcript of it out there somewhere (I don't dare to look cause theres spoilers and I'd rather die than get spoiled). Or maybe one of you guys speaks Russian, or you know someone who does.

Anyone?

[E Pluribus Unum]

Ripped these from elsewhere:

Klugh: Mikhail Mikhail you know what to do
Mikhail: We still have the other way out
Klugh: We can not risk it, you know the conditions
Mikhail: There is another way
Klugh: They captured us, we will not let them get into the territory
Klugh: You know what to do, that’s an order
Mikhail: We still have another way
Klugh: Just do it Mikhail
Mikhail: Forgive me

As per usual, it doesn't really give us anything informative, kind of just explains what we were expecting. She seems to be pulling rank on Patchy and telling him it's "the only way".

Maybe Klugh is (or was) a valuable member, and the 'others' may have considered a trade - but Klugh thought that her death would make the 'others' less vulnerable?

I kind of think they would have been punished in some way (by this mysterious 'Him') especially after what happened to Mikhail, where as Klughs death could be put down to dying rather than telling them their secrets - Mikhails death did nothing but warn the Losties of the invisible fence. Which says to me Mikhail wanted to die for his own reasons - i.e. so he wasn't 'banished' or the like.

[Mrs Ferg]

hmmm interesting, thanks E PLURIBUS UNUM (great username where did that come from?)

What interested me the most was;

Klugh: They captured us, we will not let them get into the territory

Which may explain why Mikhail said thankyou when they pushed him thru the boundary sensors. I think he was geniunely thankful because (1) he knew that the losties knew that the boundary was working (dispite him saying it wasnt) and (2) a fate worse than death awaited him if they succeeded in getting over the boundary because they would have him as a negotiation tactic.

[D-Roc]

Originally Posted by E PLURIBUS UNUM,March 23, 2007 09:00 am

Ripped these from elsewhere:

Klugh: Mikhail Mikhail you know what to do
Mikhail: We still have the other way out
Klugh: We can not risk it, you know the conditions
Mikhail: There is another way
Klugh: They captured us, we will not let them get into the territory
Klugh: You know what to do, that’s an order
Mikhail: We still have another way
Klugh: Just do it Mikhail
Mikhail: Forgive me

As per usual, it doesn't really give us anything informative, kind of just explains what we were expecting. She seems to be pulling rank on Patchy and telling him it's "the only way".

Maybe Klugh is (or was) a valuable member, and the 'others' may have considered a trade - but Klugh thought that her death would make the 'others' less vulnerable?

I kind of think they would have been punished in some way (by this mysterious 'Him') especially after what happened to Mikhail, where as Klughs death could be put down to dying rather than telling them their secrets - Mikhails death did nothing but warn the Losties of the invisible fence. Which says to me Mikhail wanted to die for his own reasons - i.e. so he wasn't 'banished' or the like.

This kinda reminded me of the trial that the Others have. We know that killing is outlawed..particularly killing their own or without absolute need. Therefore perhaps there are other 'wrong', such as leading a group of angry stranger to their home (understandable, imo). Also, perhaps Mikahil said "Thankyou" because he'd rather face death via Sonic Cerebrum Crusher than he would by execution by his own people..or over getting marked. Are these the "conditions" he spoke of?

Peopple may not understand this - but it strikes me that codes of secrecy have be sworn by..who knows what these codes entail? Personally I can kinda understand Mikhails joy or 'release' at getting pushed through the pylons..for some people being a turncoat or a traitor (even by proxy) is a terrible sin.

At least he had one of the coolest death scenes ever in LOST.

Oh and notice Mikhails "Forgive me", to Bea moments before he killed her. Says alot.

[Verix]

I think his said thankyou because he's rather die in battle than live having 'helped' the losties. Just like Kor said, he didn't want to be a traitor to his people.


Though i think it sucks that he's dead, e was easily one of the (if not the) coolest others we've seen.

[haelle03]

Didnt you see what happened to Juliet? They were gonna kill her! I assume the Others were going to kill Mikhail and Bea, and they may as well die there instead of leading them to the Others and being killed there.

[hundredand8]

Interesting, thanks E_P_U for this transcript!

This idea that they rather be dead now than be dead later doesn't quite work for me. We have seen that the Others hold trials, so they would have a chance to go free.

Its either as Rocco says that they couldn't live with the thought of being branded as a traitor (even if the trial can't prove they are guilty and so they can go free). Or leading strangers into the territory has some severe consequences of a different nature. Like a terrible curse will fall on the whole community, a disease will strike or something. Superstition in other words, and haven't we been there before, with the whole Danielle/disease story line that seems to have fizzled out?

[D-Roc]

Originally Posted by Verix,March 23, 2007 10:09 am

Though i think it sucks that he's dead, e was easily one of the (if not the) coolest others we've seen.

Yeah i agree, he was a very cool character and i thought he might turn out to be this seasons 'Ben' - because Ben was introduced at around this time last season (well, 2x14, i believe).

To be fair though, all of the Others are pretty 'cool' characters imo. Ben, Ethan, Goodwin, Jules..even Isabelle is pretty awesome, even though she's only been in one episode.

[D-Roc]

Originally Posted by hundredand8,March 23, 2007 04:42 pm

This idea that they rather be dead now than be dead later doesn't quite work for me. We have seen that the Others hold trials, so they would have a chance to go free.

Its either as Rocco says that they couldn't live with the thought of being branded as a traitor (even if the trial can't prove they are guilty and so they can go free). Or leading strangers into the territory has some severe consequences of a different nature. Like a terrible curse will fall on the whole community, a disease will strike or something. Superstition in other words, and haven't we been there before, with the whole Danielle/disease story line that seems to have fizzled out?

But they wouldnt..they have very strict laws on certain issues - unless the Guv'nor Ben gives the say so then they'd probably face death by their own and that is perhaps a shame on their lives (in terms of it being undignified and all that). Yes, the trials do offer some form of democracy (perhaps the most systematic form of democracy that we have seen on the island), however I believe that certain actions would mean that a trial would be a formality and that they would therefore rather be killed in battle (or whathaveyou) than be killed by their own Others or commit suicide.

Im not sure about the 'superstition' angle ..i dont think it's because of anything like that - i think it's more logical in that they have codes of conduct which they have sworn to uphold. Though you never know, that coundown timer with the word 'Underworld' has left an indeligible mark so who knows, lol

[hundredand8]

Originally Posted by KoR-evo,March 24, 2007 12:42 pm

But they wouldnt..they have very strict laws on certain issues - unless the Guv'nor Ben gives the say so then they'd probably face death by their own and that is perhaps a shame on their lives (in terms of it being undignified and all that). Yes, the trials do offer some form of democracy (perhaps the most systematic form of democracy that we have seen on the island), however I believe that certain actions would mean that a trial would be a formality and that they would therefore rather be killed in battle (or whathaveyou) than be killed by their own Others or commit suicide.

Im not sure about the 'superstition' angle ..i dont think it's because of anything like that - i think it's more logical in that they have codes of conduct which they have sworn to uphold. Though you never know, that coundown timer with the word 'Underworld' has left an indeligible mark so who knows, lol

Let me try another angle on "superstition". See if that works for you.

Assuming the Others have indeed been on the island for a very long time. Ever since someone built Stonehenge-on-the-Hill and the statue with four toes, most of which is now in the ocean (well I don't know that for a fact, I mean the statue lying in the ocean, but you get what I mean ).

Who says they hold rational beliefs? Who says the Reformation happened on the island? Maybe their society is still in a state of quasi religious or medieval belief systems? A belief system that includes sacrificial offerings to their god ("Him" anyone?) and very strict Dos and Don'ts that have no basis in reality. And on an island like this one who can blame them, this is not exactly the place to believe in strict scientific explanations to start with. (No, I don't mean Britain , I mean the island on Lost)

So in this case the belief may well be that if a person who is not "good" enters the "sanctuary", something terrible will happen. Who knows, maybe something terrible happened last time, by coincidence rather than causality. Bea and Mikhail may have thought that the only way to prevent that from happening again is to not show these "not good" people the way.

[Toby]

Only just watched the eppisode 1 hour ago!

WoW!!

So, Ms. Klugh... I reckon, that
1. death is a release to a new life for them, and so it isnt that big a deal. They have two ways out, death and "the other way". So self sacrifice does not matter.

OR

2. Each lostie character has an Other equivelent: hers was micheal. As micheal has left the island, she isnt needed much anymore, so she can sacrifice herself whenever.

Great thread ^^ Good to be back Even if it is only for 20 mins.