Further reason to hate Anthony?

[D-Roc]

In LD I felt so sorry for Locke. Just when he was about to let Anthoney go and move on with his new life with Helen up pops his 'dead' father to ruin everything for him again. I wish Locke had just ignored Anthony's plea and turned him down..afterall it was quite clear [i thought] that Locke didnt help him for the money, rather for some reason he felt inclined to do one more thing for his dad. But why? If anything didnt Anthony owe Locke..and not the otherway around? Maybe Helen helped him to 'forgive'? However does this tell us something about Locke..that his desperate need for a 'father figure' is big enough to make him keep coming back..and make him continue to hold on? Has the 'island' replaced Anthony as his new father figure I wonder?

Also, I found it particularly interesting at just how 'thankful' Locke was to Henry for 'not leaving him'. I think this tells us a lot about Locke..alot about his fear at being left behind by people [eg Anthony, Helen, Emily, the other Helen etc] and so by coming back for him Locke now feels slightly indebted to him? [yet he wasnt to Jack in exodus? hmm]. But could this be dangerous for Locke..could his gratitude cost him..afterall 'once bitten twice shy', you would think..but Locke just keeps on coming back and continues to put himself out there to be hurt. Maybe he's too trusting..then again if the other option is to be like Sayid's recent character regression, then perhaps it's not so bad to trust..even if you do end up getting hurt maybe allowing yourself to trust is the right thing to do..perhaps Ana has learnt this?

[*SP*]

I think the wording of it is sooo significant and was going to make a thread myself. 'Thank You Henry...Thank you for not leaving me!' I thought it was so sad. I don't blame Locke for having trust issues after all he's been through. You could say he doesn't learn and keeps putting himself out there to be let down but I think I'd sooner see that be his 'character flaw' than for him to become twisted and bitter about everything. At least he continues to have hope. As long as he can differentiate between an appropriate level of gratitude and appreciation for Henry's help and feeling that he is hugely indebted to him. If I recall correctly he never technically gave Henry his word that he would protect him anyway.

[Kiowa Warrior]

Originally Posted by KoRevo,Aug 16 2006, 10:09 AM

In LD I felt so sorry for Locke. Just when he was about to let Anthoney go and move on with his new life with Helen up pops his 'dead' father to ruin everything for him again. I wish Locke had just ignored Anthony's plea and turned him down..afterall it was quite clear [i thought] that Locke didnt help him for the money, rather for some reason he felt inclined to do one more thing for his dad. But why? If anything didnt Anthony owe Locke..and not the otherway around? Maybe Helen helped him to 'forgive'? However does this tell us something about Locke..that his desperate need for a 'father figure' is big enough to make him keep coming back..and make him continue to hold on? Has the 'island' replaced Anthony as his new father figure I wonder?

Also, I found it particularly interesting at just how 'thankful' Locke was to Henry for 'not leaving him'. I think this tells us a lot about Locke..alot about his fear at being left behind by people [eg Anthony, Helen, Emily, the other Helen etc] and so by coming back for him Locke now feels slightly indebted to him? [yet he wasnt to Jack in exodus? hmm]. But could this be dangerous for Locke..could his gratitude cost him..afterall 'once bitten twice shy', you would think..but Locke just keeps on coming back and continues to put himself out there to be hurt. Maybe he's too trusting..then again if the other option is to be like Sayid's recent character regression, then perhaps it's not so bad to trust..even if you do end up getting hurt maybe allowing yourself to trust is the right thing to do..perhaps Ana has learnt this?

Aww poor Locke! I felt so sorry for him after Anthony shamelessly used him again, and then for Helen to decline his proposal I think that Locke does have a need for a father figure in his life and is willing to cling onto anything that resembles one, such as the heartless Anthony and even the island in a sense. But more than that I think that Locke just wants some stability in his life, and someone to be there for him and that he can rely on. It shows how desperate Locke is (oh I hate describing him like that!) for someone to look out for him out of their own free will when Henry came back for him...he was so relieved and so happy to see him that it was just heart wrenching to watch.

And then it's revealed that Locke was conned yet again, and that Henry is not who in fact he said he was - he looked Locke straight in the eye and lied to him (I guess Locke got a taste of how Helen felt when he lied to her).

I agree with you in that Locke does feel slightly indebted to Henry and will try his best to look out for him; and he will feel this way even though Henry lied to him and probably stayed behind with him more out of selfish than selfless reasons. And I think that most people would, after being conned and let down, become harder and more distrustful of people in general; they would build a wall around themselves to protect them from getting hurt again. But Locke does keep coming back for more and more punishment - perhaps he's hoping that the next person will be the real deal that will genuinly care for him and won't leave him, or that he feels that if he's been hurt before than there's nothing new that could hurt him. Perhaps he's just willing to keep on taking leaps of faith in people, and doesn't want to face the horrible reality that his faith is, more often than not, misplaced.

SP I loved that line of Locke's as well and it really was just so sad to hear Locke bare his real desire (for people not to abandon him) like that. And I agree that I would rather Locke's character fault be too trusting and needful than for a far darker and twisted one (like Sayid's disturbingly casusal use of violence). However I think that Locke did actually offer Henry his protection: (this is from the episode's transcript)

GALE: Then I'm going to need your word, John. I'm going to need your word that you won't let your people do anything to me.
LOCKE: Well, if you're who you say you are then what are you worried about?
GALE: Things have happened to them -- things that I have nothing to do with. But they've got no one to blame except for me. So I'm going to need your word that you'll protect me, no matter what.
[Locke opens the armory door.]
LOCKE: Who are you?
GALE: My name is Henry Gale. I'm from Minnesota. And I crashed on this island just like you.
LOCKE: Alright, you have my word.

[D-Roc]

Originally Posted by *SP*,Aug 16 2006, 12:12 PM

I think the wording of it is sooo significant and was going to make a thread myself. 'Thank You Henry...Thank you for not leaving me!' I thought it was so sad. I don't blame Locke for having trust issues after all he's been through. You could say he doesn't learn and keeps putting himself out there to be let down but I think I'd sooner see that be his 'character flaw' than for him to become twisted and bitter about everything. At least he continues to have hope. As long as he can differentiate between an appropriate level of gratitude and appreciation for Henry's help and feeling that he is hugely indebted to him. If I recall correctly he never technically gave Henry his word that he would protect him anyway.

Yeah, that sthe thing, he continues to have 'hope'..i have to commend that and like you said it can be viewed as a character flaw, as so many people have taken advantage of him or deserted him, but i do hope that he continues to have 'hope' as that for me was one of the defining and most inspirational aspects of his S1 character.

And he didnt promise HG that he would protect him did he. I thought Locke was very realistic there..and at least he dindt commit to promising something that he knew he might later break.

[*SP*]

Originally Posted by Kiowa Warrior,Aug 16 2006, 14:57 PM

SP I loved that line of Locke's as well and it really was just so sad to hear Locke bare his real desire (for people not to abandon him) like that. And I agree that I would rather Locke's character fault be too trusting and needful than for a far darker and twisted one (like Sayid's disturbingly casusal use of violence). However I think that Locke did actually offer Henry his protection: (this is from the episode's transcript)

GALE: Then I'm going to need your word, John. I'm going to need your word that you won't let your people do anything to me.
LOCKE: Well, if you're who you say you are then what are you worried about?
GALE: Things have happened to them -- things that I have nothing to do with. But they've got no one to blame except for me. So I'm going to need your word that you'll protect me, no matter what.
[Locke opens the armory door.]
LOCKE: Who are you?
GALE: My name is Henry Gale. I'm from Minnesota. And I crashed on this island just like you.
LOCKE: Alright, you have my word.

I didn't realise that was exactly what Locke had said. But, is a man's word valid when given in the face of a downright lie? To me this reads 'I give you my word based on the facts you have given me'. I don't think Locke needs to be held to this promise when Henry has looked him in the eye and lied....

I dread to think how this will affect Locke...being let down again. I felt there was a bond created between them after Henry didn't leave him. But how will he feel knowing that Henry has lied all along?

[D-Roc]

Originally Posted by Kiowa Warrior,Aug 16 2006, 15:57 PM

Aww poor Locke! I felt so sorry for him after Anthony shamelessly used him again, and then for Helen to decline his proposal I think that Locke does have a need for a father figure in his life and is willing to cling onto anything that resembles one, such as the heartless Anthony and even the island in a sense. But more than that I think that Locke just wants some stability in his life, and someone to be there for him and that he can rely on. It shows how desperate Locke is (oh I hate describing him like that!) for someone to look out for him out of their own free will when Henry came back for him...he was so relieved and so happy to see him that it was just heart wrenching to watch.

And then it's revealed that Locke was conned yet again, and that Henry is not who in fact he said he was - he looked Locke straight in the eye and lied to him (I guess Locke got a taste of how Helen felt when he lied to her).

I agree with you in that Locke does feel slightly indebted to Henry and will try his best to look out for him; and he will feel this way even though Henry lied to him and probably stayed behind with him more out of selfish than selfless reasons. And I think that most people would, after being conned and let down, become harder and more distrustful of people in general; they would build a wall around themselves to protect them from getting hurt again. But Locke does keep coming back for more and more punishment - perhaps he's hoping that the next person will be the real deal that will genuinly care for him and won't leave him, or that he feels that if he's been hurt before than there's nothing new that could hurt him. Perhaps he's just willing to keep on taking leaps of faith in people, and doesn't want to face the horrible reality that his faith is, more often than not, misplaced.

Yeah thats the remarkable thing about Locke..he keeps investing in faith..despite all that he's been through, he keeps on believing. I suppose this is why he built up such a strong resolve and great inner-strength..even when he was in his wheel chair he believed that he could go on a Walkabout and he believed that it was his destiny..he knew that he could achieve great feats and that is so impressive.

Locke's hope and faith are such that it suprised me when he turned his back on Charlie..though i can understand John's position i was quite shocked to see him have such a lack of faith in someone.