Libby & The Island

[firebreathingfishies]

Nice to see Libby back Even if she still is... well... still dead..and a bit creepy

But the apparition on the boat... Michael's guilt or the Island? Tom said that the island wouldn't let Michael kill himself. Does that mean the 'Island' (or some element of it) has been with him since he left the island?

[taffy bhoy]

good seeing her again, and nice tie in with the blankets, seeing as that was the reason she was in the hatch when she got shot lol

[IM-LOST-WITH-LOST]

Damn you FBF i was gonna make this

Yeah i could tell that it was Libby's voice in the flashback, which made me think that it was before the island... I was about to go wild cause it thought all those theories were true!!

I'm also hoping that Libby could have actually been the Real Libby Some of us said ages ago that maybe Charlie was appearing to Hurley, and it wasn't the black smoke... Perhaps the same is happening here. I'm not really sure why the island would tell Michael not to kill the frieghters, because well... it's implied that it doesn't want them there, so perhaps Libby did have a bigger role to play in it all, and is somehow connected to Widmore, and wants him to succeed?? Although that would make her on the bad side

[Lauren [is Lost]]

Originally Posted by firebreathingfishies

Nice to see Libby back Even if she still is... well... still dead..and a bit creepy

But the apparition on the boat... Michael's guilt or the Island? Tom said that the island wouldn't let Michael kill himself. Does that mean the 'Island' (or some element of it) has been with him since he left the island?

I'm thinking it's both, tbh.

[monster-eats-pilot]

I knew it was Libby's voice
That was funny

[Lauren [is Lost]]

Originally Posted by monster-eats-pilot

I knew it was Libby's voice
That was funny

Lol, i recognised the voice but i couldn't think who it was! I thought it was Juliet for a split second!!

[monster-eats-pilot]

It shows I watch lost too much as I recognised Ben's voice straight away too

[D-Roc]

I got an observation on this, but I've gotta say - Libby cleans up fairly well:



I also like the nice touch re: the blankets, since she was carrying blankets when Mike shot her in the hatch.

[D-Roc]

Ok, here's what I noticed.

Basically I've heard people debate as to whether the appearance of Libby was a dream or whether it was *really* Libby or the island..

I think it's a bit of both in that it is Michael's own subconscious rising to the surface. He still feels guilty about what he did and so his guilt is affecting his 'reality'.

When I rewatched the scene where he see's 'Libby' in the hospital, I noticed a few odd things, which i've tried to piece together - firstly Mike looks at the monitor next to him - this is the very first thing he does upon opening his eyes, and it drew my intention as it seemed 'forced' - and indeed, it turns out that this was a clue as to what was really going on. The scene is basically part dream and part real - the first part is all a subconscious dream, then when he see's Libby he wakes up and things around him are different. For example:

This is the Monitor before he starts screaming. Notice how 'old' it is:


This is the monitor he see's AFTER he starts screaming - it's clearly different and is 'modern'. Even the readings are different - one would expect them to be higher from all the panic, but they're actually lower - showing that the readings in the previous shot (above) were all a figment of Mike's imagination:


even the patient (who looks like Alvar Hanso and Kelvin, I must say) is different. When Mike first looks at him he doesn't have the gas mask on, but has tubes going into his mouth:


However, after he see'e Libby and starts screaming (i.e. after he wakes up), he looks at the man again, and see's that he does have a gas mask on, aswell as the monitor now being closer to his bed:


The camera angle also changes as Mike is screaming - another indication that he was dreaming..creating false realities based on his subconscious guilt.



Basically, I feel that this proves that 'Libby' isn't necessarily a manifestation of the smoke monster or the island, but a figment of Michael's subconscious guilt - although one could argue that the island/Smokie is the very thing which triggers this. But still, I feel that the above was intentional from the creators to give us some footing to understanding the nature of these 'off-island' visions. What does this say about Hugo's vision of Charlie at the mental home? Again, the main parallel here is 'guilt' and 'death'.



Something else which interested me is the fact that he heard mama cass on the radio before he tried to kill himself - Mama Cass is the same chick who sung the song (which names alludes me) in Desmond's opening hatch scene from S2. It's almost as if the creators are trying to allude to the idea of the past replacing current reality - the same goes for the observations above - Mike's dream changes his reality to a skewed version which is triggered by his guilt. I'm not sure how to articulate this properly yet, but there's something fishy going on..they're trying to give us more clues beneath the crumbs..

[firebreathingfishies]

Mama Cass Elliot - Make Your Own Kind of Music Best song ever.

That's a darn good thing you got there i don't think there's anything to even add to it But it was freighter Libby that creeped me out. She was wearing the same clothes that she died in (as do everyone who appears on the island) so that Libby points towards being from the Island. Maybe

[D-Roc]

Originally Posted by firebreathingfishies

Mama Cass Elliot - Make Your Own Kind of Music Best song ever.

Thats' the one, cheers FBF. Did she also sing Juliet's opening song? ..i forget

That's a darn good thing you got there i don't think there's anything to even add to it But it was freighter Libby that creeped me out. She was wearing the same clothes that she died in (as do everyone who appears on the island) so that Libby points towards being from the Island. Maybe

Ooh good point - i'm gonna rewatch that scene too and see whether it parallels with her appearance in this scene. Off the top of my head I can't recall seeing as many 'changes'..mostly because Mike was wide awake when she appeared on the freighter I guess that in itself is interesting..cos it shows that she appeared in two different 'forms', if you will - one via a dream (i guess this is similar to Boone visiting Locke, which actually could give this more context) and one by just oozing into reality, like BAM - "don't do it Michael"..

Perhaps one was his subconscious and the other the island/smokie? But then they both seemed to be guilt induced, so perhaps they're both triggered by the same thing - i.e guilt, with a bit of island connection thrown in.



Good point about the clothes! So perhaps the 2nd sighting WAS a different 'form' of Libby..cos in the first sighting she was in a nurses outfit - Oo eer Missus

Interesting FBF, veery interesting

[D-Roc]

Also, tried to get a peek at Libby's ID tag, but this was all I could muster:



I really want to know what her surname is - you know they're holding back on that for a reason.

bet she's another Shepherd..