The Helicopters

[Wolstie]

Why didnt it just land? Why have someone jump out?

To me it looked like it was having major problems staying stable when the guy jumped out. It weebled all over. I wonder if it was having the same kind of problems Naomi's helicopter did.

They also knew Naomi had medical problems and needed medical attention so why not just land at least to get her back to help?

Mabye nothing can land in that place without crashing.

[keeno_82uk]

it probably has something to do with the EMP residue. Having been discharged in the last season, it probably has some residue effects on metalic vessels nearby.

This caused the helicopter to become unstable and for them to abort a landing on the island.

Another reason may be that they didn't want to risk the islanders overthrowing the pilot and taking control of the helicopter themselves.

[D-Roc]

Glad you raised this Wolstie - I was thinking this the other day.

I deffo think this is relevant..probably, as keeno suggests, in relation to the islands EMP properties. These are trained and highly skilled people (i'd imagine..certainly going from Naomi's skills)..yet they struggle to land or come within the islands sphere, so to speak.

I'd like to take this a step further and consider something possible related.

Remember Walt..and his ability to summon birds? Those who have seen "Special" (S1) and the Mobisodes will know what i'm referring to. All of those birds 'crashed', if you will..

As did Oceanic 815 (a 'bird')..as did Henry Gale's balloon (aviation device)..and the freighties helicopters struggle to fly when over the island and seem unable to land..

My suggestion is that the island has properties which negate aviation (anything that flies)..perhaps this is the electromagnetism..perhaps it is the electromagnetism in conjunction with something else..a power, or an ability perhaps?

Perhaps this is nothing specific to aviation..as ships and vessels also struggle to safetly navigate to the island.

Also, should we consider the "Hurley bird" in all of this - from what I can recall this is the ONLY thing on or near the island that we have seen fly without crashing or having stability problems. Is the Hurley bird connected to Walt and those other birds he "summond".

Also, even Smokey cannot get more than 9 ft off the ground..........

[keeno_82uk]

i am of the view that there is a electro magnetic field still left over from the Hatch, a residue of the field, not as strong as the one that brought down the oceanic 815.

If you take a look at this diagram, but replace it with lost island and imagine anotherset of lines going vertically instead of horizonally. It kind of explains why things get pulled towards the island.



Only at the poles can you get through the magnetic field (which could be the direction the others sent Michael and Walt.

With the field now dispersing and weakening with no EMP reactor to build it up, it is allowing aviation vehicles to come closer but not allow them to actually land and take off.

[Malion]

The whole area that Jack was in was surrounded by trees, so they couldn't exactly land there. And they were headed towards where the phone was.... so they jumped out to meet them, instead of... uh, walking to them after they landed.

[D-Roc]

Originally Posted by keeno_82uk

i am of the view that there is a electro magnetic field still left over from the Hatch, a residue of the field, not as strong as the one that brought down the oceanic 815.

If you take a look at this diagram, but replace it with lost island and imagine anotherset of lines going vertically instead of horizonally. It kind of explains why things get pulled towards the island.



Only at the poles can you get through the magnetic field (which could be the direction the others sent Michael and Walt.

With the field now dispersing and weakening with no EMP reactor to build it up, it is allowing aviation vehicles to come closer but not allow them to actually land and take off.

Good stuff - yeah that's pretty much how I understand it.

Which would suggest that the incident was either an intentional incident (to create a rift or buildup in the island's electromagnetic properties, and thus conceal the island further) or it was a genuine accident which, again, came with some added benefits in terms of island concealment. Although I would assume that the island was pretty well hidden pre-Dharma anyway. Perhaps the charge merely enabled Dharma to raise or reduce the level of concealment as they pleased - almost like hacking into the islands mainframe and placing a thermostat on it, perhaps.

I guess the island is now just as well hidden as it was before Dharma came - the charge is now gone, after Des turned the key and momentarily made the island visible (Penny's ice station people)..and now the island appears to be operating under it's original concealment level. Which, as you say, appears to not be as impregnable as the Dharma 'add-on' version.

[Wolstie]

Originally Posted by Malion

The whole area that Jack was in was surrounded by trees, so they couldn't exactly land there. And they were headed towards where the phone was.... so they jumped out to meet them, instead of... uh, walking to them after they landed.

Yes but the copter looked like it was struggling and Namoi's crashed as well

[keeno_82uk]

with the EMP generator gone, i think the field is gradually going and leaving some magnetism around, hence the extreme turbulance the copters are suffering from. The reason i think it is gradually going is because at full power the EMP took down flight 815, so it could take down the copter easily. So therefore it must be disbursing over time. In time there will be no EMP and ppl can leave and go to the island freely

[Reed]

Originally Posted by D-Roc

Good stuff - yeah that's pretty much how I understand it.

Which would suggest that the incident was either an intentional incident (to create a rift or buildup in the island's electromagnetic properties, and thus conceal the island further) or it was a genuine accident which, again, came with some added benefits in terms of island concealment. Although I would assume that the island was pretty well hidden pre-Dharma anyway. Perhaps the charge merely enabled Dharma to raise or reduce the level of concealment as they pleased - almost like hacking into the islands mainframe and placing a thermostat on it, perhaps.

I guess the island is now just as well hidden as it was before Dharma came - the charge is now gone, after Des turned the key and momentarily made the island visible (Penny's ice station people)..and now the island appears to be operating under it's original concealment level. Which, as you say, appears to not be as impregnable as the Dharma 'add-on' version.

Re: the EMP - wasn't the Swan's objective to prevent the charge building up or something to the effect - i.e. releasing some pressure as it were. Just trying to get my head around this stuff.

But interesting idea that it was created to build up the EMP in the first place to protect the Island - or atleast that is what I understand you are saying. Though contradicting this is [as you say] the Fail-Safe's making the Island temporarily visible - so which is the case here? What if the Swan was created to "lure" people to the Island?

Though electromagnetism is a powerful substance and there are many reasons Dharma wanted to "collect" it. Time travel requires immense energy for one.

[Reed]

Originally Posted by keeno_82uk

with the EMP generator gone, i think the field is gradually going and leaving some magnetism around, hence the extreme turbulance the copters are suffering from. The reason i think it is gradually going is because at full power the EMP took down flight 815, so it could take down the copter easily. So therefore it must be disbursing over time. In time there will be no EMP and ppl can leave and go to the island freely

The Swan prevented the EMP "overheating" though I would have to agree the electromagetism was still great - hence causing crashes.

As for people eventually being able to come and go I am still trying to get my head around this. I would agree with D-Roc that the Island is naturally hidden but the EMP merely made it more difficult to find it and leave it - to protect it's whereabouts.

I do not know whether to agree that the electromagnetism is dying out, though it makes sense. I think the Island is still high in electromagnetism and the Swan merely built it up. Now the build up is gone, the Island is generating more of it. I think it is related to the Hotspot that the fellow explained to Rose in her flashback. The Island is a Hotspot, hence it's regeneration abilities?

[The_abbott]

Originally Posted by D-Roc

Also, should we consider the "Hurley bird" in all of this - from what I can recall this is the ONLY thing on or near the island that we have seen fly without crashing or having stability problems. Is the Hurley bird connected to Walt and those other birds he "summond".

Don't forget Claire's flock of messenger birds. Although best to forget about that idea. I mean that really was a dumb blonde moment from her

[D-Roc]

Originally Posted by Reed

Re: the EMP - wasn't the Swan's objective to prevent the charge building up or something to the effect - i.e. releasing some pressure as it were. Just trying to get my head around this stuff.

But interesting idea that it was created to build up the EMP in the first place to protect the Island - or atleast that is what I understand you are saying. Though contradicting this is [as you say] the Fail-Safe's making the Island temporarily visible - so which is the case here? What if the Swan was created to "lure" people to the Island?

Though electromagnetism is a powerful substance and there are many reasons Dharma wanted to "collect" it. Time travel requires immense energy for one.

Yeah, from what I understand that was the reason for pushing the button every 108 minutes..this mechanism would release/discharge the buildup of electromagnetism - which if it was allowed to build up beyond 108+ minutes would destroy the world - probably by sucking everything towards the island - makes you consider whether a partial build up was therefore how the BR ended up in the middle of the island (although it's not made of metal, so perhaps not).

However, now that the key has been turned, the charge has gone - according to Kelvin that is. Which makes me wonder whether it wasn't an intentional incident which caused it in the first place. I mean, if the Dharmafreaks could just get rid of the charge by turning the key, then why not do it. And the fact they had a key in the first place sends alarm bells ringing!

The only idea I can think of to make the whole thing legit, is if they wanted to further conceal the island - perhaps make it a VIP only invitation ..However the arrivals of Desmond and the 815'ers..not to mention seemingly random folk like the real Henry Gale, makes me wonder if the island wasn't trying to override Dharma's ownership of it's access, in a bid for "help"..

You also make a good suggestion in that the Swan may have been created to lure people to the island..although it would appear that Dharma already had access to and from the island, until the Purge.

Unless we're talking about luring something very particular..something very specific..which in itself throws open some potentially mind-blowing possibilities as to the true nature of Dharma's occupancy of the island.

And as you say, time-travel, presumably would require a very powerful catalyst. Infact we've already seen that being at the core of such energy was able to send Desmond back to a very specific point in his life. One wonders whether the combination of the electromagnetic energy and Desmond's minds eye, didn't propell him back. Had he been thinking of something else at the point of turning the key, he would perhaps have ended up there instead. Which, as you suggested, makes this energy the most valuable energy in the world, I would assume.

Interesting stuff